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Ничего не понял,

Rust folks: Please don’t waste your time and mental cycles on drama like this. It’s not worth your time. Either Linus likes it, or he doesn’t. Everything else is distractions orchestrated by a subset of saboteur maintainers who are trying to demoralize you until you give up, because they know they’re going to be on the losing side of history sooner or later. No amount of sabotage from old entrenched maintainers is going to stop the world from moving forward towards memory-safe languages.

FWIW, in my opinion, the "cancer" comment from Christoph would be enough to qualify for Code-of-Conduct action, but I doubt anything of the sort will happen.

I’m tired.

I’m tired of seeing positive, technically impressive kernel projects blockaded delayed by maintainers with no technical justification, and at best end up moving along at a glacial pace.

I’m tired of seeing important contributors and maintainers give up and throw the towel after enduring repeated misbehavior and hostility towards their efforts from others.

I’m tired of getting messages, privately and publicly, from all kinds of people, saying they won’t touch the kernel with a 10-foot pole due to the hostility and the baroque, regressive process.

I’m tired of seeing people get away with using words like "cancer" to describe others’ work, with zero repercussion.

I’m tired of politely and calmly calling out hostile and unwelcoming behavior from maintainers and suggest ways to improve, only to be ignored and nothing change (note: this refers to other instances, not this instance).

I’m tired of having to spend hours or days of my time to upstream simple things, because even the simplest of changes en up in a bikeshed.

I’m tired of having to manually format code instead of using clang-format.

I’m tired of drive-by nitpickers who send useless review comments on code they don’t take the time to understand.

I’m tired of having to review patches in an email client, where I can’t even tell which patches are for me to merge and not without writing complex filtering rules to correlate email bodies with kernel subsystem paths, which I don’t have the time to write and maintain.

I’m tired of having to type a half dozen b4 commands just to send a change.

And I’m tired of hearing things will get better if I just "trust the process" or let people work from within, while nothing seems to have actually changed in years despite endless discussion about these problems on the sidelines.

If shaming on social media does not work, then tell me what does, because I’m out of ideas.

I’m not talking about individual technical problems. You cannot solve social and community problems with technical arguments.

Yes, given enough patience and technical argumentation, you can get code into the kernel, or maybe even get some existing code refactored. That doesn’t change the fact that the process is often quite terrible, hostile to newcomers, demoralizing, and by wide consensus much worse than practically any other FOSS project, even those of similar scope to the kernel.

And what I see, is very little effort to improve that status quo, or at least very little that yields any actual change that isn’t just band-aids (e.g. tooling like b4, which is nice and appreciated, but doesn’t fix any underlying issues). And that’s not going to change no matter how many long technical arguments we have on the MLs (or even off MLs, since MLs are also not particularly good for this, and I’ve seen multiple arguments only reach a resolution after being redirected to IRC).

But I’ve used up all my spoons for this, and clearly Linus doesn’t think there’s a problem in this thread worth replying to other than myself, so I’m giving up on fighting for any change or being part of the kernel maintainer community. Whether the rest of the kernel community chooses to continue to live in an ugly bubble or actually try to fix some of these systemic issues, is up to them.

Oh, and one last thing. I’ve heard that, in whatever backroom conversations you’ve been having about this situation, there has apparently been a belief, explicit or implicit, that I am in any way employed to work on the Linux kernel.

Unlike most people in this thread, I don’t enjoy the luxury of a cushy tech job that pays me to deal with this community. I am supported exclusively by donations, which incidentally, have been steadily decreasing since the start of the Asahi Linux project. The project has zero corporate sponsorship.

And I do believe the fact that essentially all high-level Linux kernel maintainers and contributors are paid by corporations to do it is a major factor that has caused this community to become wildly out of touch with what it means to be a community FOSS project.

Ничего не понял,

Rust folks: Please don’t waste your time and mental cycles on drama like this. It’s not worth your time. Either Linus likes it, or he doesn’t. Everything else is distractions orchestrated by a subset of saboteur maintainers who are trying to demoralize you until you give up, because they know they’re going to be on the losing side of history sooner or later. No amount of sabotage from old entrenched maintainers is going to stop the world from moving forward towards memory-safe languages.

FWIW, in my opinion, the "cancer" comment from Christoph would be enough to qualify for Code-of-Conduct action, but I doubt anything of the sort will happen.

I’m tired.

I’m tired of seeing positive, technically impressive kernel projects blockaded delayed by maintainers with no technical justification, and at best end up moving along at a glacial pace.

I’m tired of seeing important contributors and maintainers give up and throw the towel after enduring repeated misbehavior and hostility towards their efforts from others.

I’m tired of getting messages, privately and publicly, from all kinds of people, saying they won’t touch the kernel with a 10-foot pole due to the hostility and the baroque, regressive process.

I’m tired of seeing people get away with using words like "cancer" to describe others’ work, with zero repercussion.

I’m tired of politely and calmly calling out hostile and unwelcoming behavior from maintainers and suggest ways to improve, only to be ignored and nothing change (note: this refers to other instances, not this instance).

I’m tired of having to spend hours or days of my time to upstream simple things, because even the simplest of changes en up in a bikeshed.

I’m tired of having to manually format code instead of using clang-format.

I’m tired of drive-by nitpickers who send useless review comments on code they don’t take the time to understand.

I’m tired of having to review patches in an email client, where I can’t even tell which patches are for me to merge and not without writing complex filtering rules to correlate email bodies with kernel subsystem paths, which I don’t have the time to write and maintain.

I’m tired of having to type a half dozen b4 commands just to send a change.

And I’m tired of hearing things will get better if I just "trust the process" or let people work from within, while nothing seems to have actually changed in years despite endless discussion about these problems on the sidelines.

If shaming on social media does not work, then tell me what does, because I’m out of ideas.

I’m not talking about individual technical problems. You cannot solve social and community problems with technical arguments.

Yes, given enough patience and technical argumentation, you can get code into the kernel, or maybe even get some existing code refactored. That doesn’t change the fact that the process is often quite terrible, hostile to newcomers, demoralizing, and by wide consensus much worse than practically any other FOSS project, even those of similar scope to the kernel.

And what I see, is very little effort to improve that status quo, or at least very little that yields any actual change that isn’t just band-aids (e.g. tooling like b4, which is nice and appreciated, but doesn’t fix any underlying issues). And that’s not going to change no matter how many long technical arguments we have on the MLs (or even off MLs, since MLs are also not particularly good for this, and I’ve seen multiple arguments only reach a resolution after being redirected to IRC).

But I’ve used up all my spoons for this, and clearly Linus doesn’t think there’s a problem in this thread worth replying to other than myself, so I’m giving up on fighting for any change or being part of the kernel maintainer community. Whether the rest of the kernel community chooses to continue to live in an ugly bubble or actually try to fix some of these systemic issues, is up to them.

Oh, and one last thing. I’ve heard that, in whatever backroom conversations you’ve been having about this situation, there has apparently been a belief, explicit or implicit, that I am in any way employed to work on the Linux kernel.

Unlike most people in this thread, I don’t enjoy the luxury of a cushy tech job that pays me to deal with this community. I am supported exclusively by donations, which incidentally, have been steadily decreasing since the start of the Asahi Linux project. The project has zero corporate sponsorship.

And I do believe the fact that essentially all high-level Linux kernel maintainers and contributors are paid by corporations to do it is a major factor that has caused this community to become wildly out of touch with what it means to be a community FOSS project.